T20 struggles

[cde]

This is really interesting. I may try to do something looking at wickets falling. Whilst economies are fine maybe scores are low because sides are bowled out too often, 8.11 over 3 overs is a lot less runs than 8.11 over 4 overs as an example.

I'm starting to keep stats on this but I tend to bowl first and bowl out teams for low totals. I'm playing as Glamorgan and have still have five bowlers from the initial squad with the following averages and economy rate

Lloyd - 17.31 @ 7.38
Neser - 16.10 @ 6.87
Douthwaite - 17.59 @ 7.59
Taylor - 15.67 @ 6.59
Sisodiya - 15.04 @ 6.54

I quote these players because they are in the initial squad and therefore a known quantity unlike the regens. Of the regens bowlers in the squad the highest average is 25.35 @ 7.57 but the second highest is 15.69 @ 6.51. I have two averaging just over 10.

I've just started a new T20 comp in this save so have started to record how many times I bowl a team out.

[Jamesy1984]

Some people won’t like this but playing ball by ball offline in T20 seems the best way to play and also at the back end of a one day game. Every ball is crucial and you need to adapt to what the opposition is doing.

I know it’s not feasible to play so much ball by ball offline.

[Jobi1K]

Just completed my first ENG season in terms of limited overs comps, and generally pleased with how it went. In the T20, as I've previously mentioned I've really struggled in this format in previous editions - think I got to the quarter-finals once in each of CC18 and CC20, but in this I made it to the quarters at the first attempt, winning 9 games and finishing 1st in the group! Unfortunately, when the QF came round, all my high-profile batters came back from the 100 in absolutely appalling form, and I was never really in it in the game - ended up comfortably beaten after the whole top order went for single figures. Overall though, while I enjoyed the gameplay a lot more, it wasn't a high-scoring season, so I can appreciate what other posters have been saying about the scoring. I conceded over 200 twice (and even then only a 201 and a 204), but my highest team total was just 169. In fairness, I always prefer to chase in T20, so a lot of my wins came chasing down totals where I'd kept the opposition to lowish scores, twice bowling opponents out for under 100 (including rolling Worcestershire for 42!). So who knows, maybe I would have gone higher in some of those games!

Meanwhile, the one-day cup I found a bit more of a challenge. I won 5 and lost 3, only missing out on qualification on net run rate - annoyingly, I was 2nd in the table with 2 games to play, but contrived to lose the penultimate game against a team that had only won 1 out of 6 games before that point. If I'd won that one, I'd have won the group (the top 4 all finished on the same points). I thought I'd done OK with my squad, but I think I hadn't quite clocked just how many of my batters would be off playing the 100, so I was left with a handful of mainly very young and inexperienced batters, most of whom were defensive minded. Perhaps says everything that my top run-scorer in the comp was a V.Def regen. I had a lot more bowlers to choose from, but struggled to get them into form and effectiveness. In all three of my defeats in the comp I conceded over 300, so some quite big scores there, but again my own top score was way below that (272), although perhaps not surprising given my available batting resources, and only 1 of my 5 wins came batting first.

So, overall impressions are that it is tough to score big, but I have definitely enjoyed the limited-overs gameplay more than previous editions and have felt more in control of things. Hopefully with a bit more careful squad-building and fine-tuning of tactics I'll be able to kick on in the next seasons.

[amacca1234]

Still infuriates me. You're going along hitting boundries then get to the end of the innings and suddenly it's only singles. I just don't get it. Keep the aggression down early and you don't go score enough. Increase and the batter gets out.

[Chris_]

I'm only in my first season on CC21 but I have to say I've found the 20 Over games more balanced and fun (so far) than CC20 where it often felt like flipping a coin.

I'm playing the County game in England and as others have mentioned, the constant clouds do seem to keep scores down. That goes both ways though, it's not just that I can't hit 200 while the AI do. I'm currently 2nd in my group after 11 games (W 7, L 4) and I've had a couple of scores of 163 and 162 but I've also won with innings in the 140s and 130s where the weather has been worse. Plus a couple of games with rain causing reduced overs. In CC20 it often felt like I needed to reach 160+ each time as a minimum to have a chance but now there are matches where I actually feel good averaging over 7 runs per over.

I did have an interesting match where I hit 161 and then bowled the AI all out for 84. I'm assuming they went super aggressive from the start to try to match by score but I had one bowler claim 6 wickets for 6 runs in his 4 overs during the power play / restricted field at the start which I've never seen before. It was moderately cloudy, but not the worst conditions I've seen though.

Aside from that game, most of the 20 over games so far have felt fairly close, but I do feel like I've bowled the AI all out more frequently that previous versions.

Typically I'm starting all batsmen on 7 bars and keeping them there most of the time, moving up to 9 in the last several overs if I have wickets to spare. I've only dropped to 6 (highest yellow) when the conditions were terrible, but then lost by a few runs as I didn't score enough. For bowling I have been starting my first pair on 3 bars with the default settings (outside-off, 1 slip) and claimed quite a few early wickets. The remaining bowlers I typically drop to 2 bars and manually move the line from mid to outside-off (I'm not sure why 2 bars goes back from outside-off to the middle by default). I haven't used 1 or 0 bars at all, unlike previous versions, as I'm not keen on the lack of anyone in the slips - I get quite a few catches there and don't feel the extra outfielder is worth losing that, given how well my bowling has typically been.

It might be different in countries where the weather is nice and sunny, but this has been working for me in cloudy old England so far.

[Lynx54321]

I think it's more than possible that it was too easy to score in 20 Overs in CC 2020. I've just recorded all economies from a season of 20 Over in England in CC 2021.

CC 2021 Economy in my Eng 20 Over Test: 8.13

Real life 2020 20 Over Blast Economy: 8.11

Real life 2019 20 Over Blast Economy: 8.23

Spreadsheet attached with adjustments to properly balance balls as part of 1 (CC doesn't display balls in the over, but can be worked out fairly easily as the economy does include that).

If anyone else wants to run their own tests, feel free to use the spreadsheet. Simple formulas, took me about 45 minutes to do, would probably be quicker next time around. End of competition in player records, with bowling layout selected and Eng 20 Over label selected.

I think the numbers are as good as you can get based on that test.

Indian 20 over scores should be a bit lower than England (~7.60 economy in last two seasons).

Australia and England are very similar numbers in real life.

This is really interesting. I may try to do something looking at wickets falling. Whilst economies are fine maybe scores are low because sides are bowled out too often, 8.11 over 3 overs is a lot less runs than 8.11 over 4 overs as an example.

[Wilted]

The real T20 woe is when you're trying to win the T20 World Cup with an associate team and you need 14 runs off 9 overs. Despite having 7 wickets left you still get bowled out.

[Sureshot]

Not sure about this at all. I've played 12 seasons now and have rarely passed 200 against anyone.

I went back on 2020 and could break 200 much easier in England or as England.

I did a 2021 IPL season as Delhi and didn't pass 200 either. Still won the tournament...

Just feels to me like players aren't hitting at the end like they did on 2020 except for the very rare occasions.

I think it's more than possible that it was too easy to score in 20 Overs in CC 2020. I've just recorded all economies from a season of 20 Over in England in CC 2021.

CC 2021 Economy in my Eng 20 Over Test: 8.13

Real life 2020 20 Over Blast Economy: 8.11

Real life 2019 20 Over Blast Economy: 8.23

Spreadsheet attached with adjustments to properly balance balls as part of 1 (CC doesn't display balls in the over, but can be worked out fairly easily as the economy does include that).

If anyone else wants to run their own tests, feel free to use the spreadsheet. Simple formulas, took me about 45 minutes to do, would probably be quicker next time around. End of competition in player records, with bowling layout selected and Eng 20 Over label selected.

I think the numbers are as good as you can get based on that test.

Indian 20 over scores should be a bit lower than England (~7.60 economy in last two seasons).

Australia and England are very similar numbers in real life.

[cde]

I have found that building a strong T20 batting line-up in the domestic competitions from weaker beginnings quite hard.

As stated many times before I like to bowl first and find it easy to build a decent bowling attack - for a start you only need 4 good bowlers and a decent all-rounder rather than 6 good batsmen and the all-rounder - and keep teams to low totals. I also like to have one of my T20 overseas signings as an opener so I almost always get a good start.

So in three seasons I have managed to bowl first 81% of the time and won 82% of those matches.

I am chasing less than 150 80% of the time.
Less than 140 60%.
Less than 130 51%
Less than 100 20%

So my batsmen can cruise to a win without too much stress, though in the early days even that can be a struggle! This does mean that young batsmen are rarely stress tested and it is hard to tell how they will hold up having to go out and smash it from the start. I regularly fall flat on my face when trying to do so, especially since I have not yet determined who can, or can not, accelerate at the end of the innings.

So my success rate chasing over 150 is just 43% though when batting first I am scoring over 150 51% of the time. My top score in those three years is just 172.

The batting line up has been weak and brittle and I would say that I don't really have a 5 or 6 I am happy with. I would expect these totals to rise over the next few seasons as I find some middle order players and manage to test them out.

Anyone else having the same issues?

[galvatron]

My assumption on how AI picks home pitches was completely wrong, so that's not the issue.

Chris was playing the game all day on Saturday whilst watching the Test, he's pretty happy with the balance in short formats, as am I.

i think the more people posting totals from seasons in Eng and Aus 20 over would be great for everyone.

Not sure about this at all. I've played 12 seasons now and have rarely passed 200 against anyone.

I went back on 2020 and could break 200 much easier in England or as England.

I did a 2021 IPL season as Delhi and didn't pass 200 either. Still won the tournament...

Just feels to me like players aren't hitting at the end like they did on 2020 except for the very rare occasions.

[Sureshot]

That’s a great point especially playing in England all pitches seem either bowler friendly or bad weather. We do have some sun in summer

My assumption on how AI picks home pitches was completely wrong, so that's not the issue.

Chris was playing the game all day on Saturday whilst watching the Test, he's pretty happy with the balance in short formats, as am I.

i think the more people posting totals from seasons in Eng and Aus 20 over would be great for everyone.

[cde]

My scores for both T20 and OD matches haven't changed much over the years if I'm honest and I really don't have an issue with it. It doesn't affect how much I enjoy the game.

If I was struggling to keep teams below 180 but struggled to reach that without a pie-hot line up that would be an issue, but I'm not. so it isn't.

Is it really true to life? Maybe not but I find the challenge of winning within the confines of how the game plays more enjoyable than if every single score and player was bang on the money.

I put up the average scores for interest more than anything else.

[Jamesy1984]

Also in that time I haven't dropped a OD game in two years, have conceded over 250 once and on average concede 197 despite having to blood regens and youth players every year.

It’s hard to judge the one day engine in English one day cup because all squads are wrecked by the 100. Will try and judge this more now I got the England job, currently of the opinion the only issue with game is t20 scores in England are too low, otherwise very much enjoying

[cde]

Also in that time I haven't dropped a OD game in two years, have conceded over 250 once and on average concede 197 despite having to blood regens and youth players every year.

[cde]

My totals are nothing like that at all.

I decided to start keeping track of some of my stats and although they are only from just two seasons in one save - and a year into that save - they aren't a million miles away from what I would usually expect.

My preference is to bowl first, which I have managed to do 73% of the time and over the two years and 32 matches I conceded over 150 on only three occasions and on average concede 129 runs.

Surprise surprise I'm playing as Glamorgan and while the bowling line-up is decent enough with Nasser, van der Gugten, Douthwaite, Sisodiya and Taylor with a few regens it is hardly international grade.

While I can see why my rather young and brittle batting line up might be averaging lower than the real life T20 average I can't see how that would apply to other teams.