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Batting in t20s still feels like an absolute mess

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  • #61
    Originally posted by Yorkie View Post
    T20 is not something I struggle with although the forum shows a lot do. You must have quality aggressive openers with good form. And agg/v.agg middle order. Also the secret is to play ball by ball, this way aggression can be changed each ball. Try to bat second and keep up with the run rate but remember it’s a game of 2 halves..meaning your bowlers should have also done their job, making it easier for your batters.
    I always set my home conditions to suit seam and use 4 different types of seamer (incl LF) and an in form spinner/SLA if poss. Sometimes 6 players who can bowl and drop the most expensive bowler out. Works for me...
    Having lost my first 3 games I’ve now just won 7 games in a row! A record for me so will just stick to my own formula.
    Good luck
    Can you expand a little on the aggression changes you make? I must have tried everything else suggested on here, to little effect...

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    • #62
      Compared to reality, there aren't enough singles. Also bowlers are overpowered in T20, it's quite common for not many wickets to fall at all and stemming runs is more about good fielding.

      On the game you bang loads of boundaries but then when you need 40 from 4 the opposition can bowl 10 dot balls! In reality, at the death, there are very few dot balls because the batsmen will run on everything. I think this really needs to change as you can often get to a winning position but someone comes on and bowls 5 dots in an over and kills the game.


      Bowlers seem to take too many wickets in T20 and too regularly. Batsmen are better at preserving their wicket in T20 compared to the game.

      Also, tailenders are more adept at scoring than on the game. Especially bowlers. In reality, the likes of Starc, Archer, Broad etc can come in and biff some runs but on the game they usually get out straight away. Bowlers are better batsmen than the game gives them credit for I feel.
      Last edited by galvatron; 09-12-2020, 10:27 AM.

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      • #63
        Well wonders never cease. Just won the T20 final versus Glamorgan. Was a nervous knock but managed a record Innings for me of 180 for 1.
        Lost Lyth early doors but Cadmore and Root knocked the ball to all corners! Luckily both on 5 stars form, and surprisingly Root did return from Tour with 5 stars, not so often I’ve seen that with any player coming off tour!

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        • #64
          I'd been struggling in 20 Over matches and tried a bunch of approaches; starting lower aggression and building up as they settle, starting high, adjusting to target a specific run rate, adjusting based on the bowler and conditions and so on. I kept losing more than I won.

          In the past couple of years of my save I've been reaching the playoffs and it's been with a simple batting strategy when I bat first: Start everyone on 7 bars (the first into orange) and leave them there. In the last few overs I might put a batsman up onto 8 bars if they're settled and hitting it really well, but sometimes this just makes them swing and miss a lot which actually ends up scoring less than on 7. Max aggression has always been a near-instant Out. Less than 7 never gives enough runs, regardless of conditions. Sometimes I'll lose a couple of wickets quite early but then a pair get settled and rack up the runs.

          If I bat second I'll stick to 7 bars if I'm chasing a decent score. If I managed to bowl the other team out for something really low I might use 6 bars.

          It then comes down to how well my bowlers do.

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          • #65
            20 overs is a bit of a mess. Even more so online when some teams can go ballistic from the start and not lose wickets. I've just done a tournament offline with India playing Papa New Guinea. Even on that I can't blast away without losing lots of wickets! But online seems to be a different game.

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            • #66
              Chris_ I do the same, 7 bars unless the batsman is in great form and settled. Anything more is swiping at the breeze. I find it works enough of the time to be happy with it and if it doesn’t I change a batsman or two until it clicks.

              The batting I find more of an issue than bowling. I find that especially once you are playing better sides it is remorseless. If your batsman aren’t quite up to it they are shown up quite quickly and with no opportunity to find form.

              The number of times I have found a line up that wipes the floor with the opposition one year and then have to drop two or three of the batsman the next is pretty regular. Stepping up to international it is much the same, not quite good enough means lots of low totals with the occasional blast.

              galvatron

              That is frustrating - against someone like PNG you should be able to pile on the runs. Upsets happen but very irregularly.

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              • #67
                My last match was a good example:

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                I kept Durham to 158 for 7 and needed just over 7.9 runs per over to beat them. I started on my usual 7 aggression and it was a horrible start, losing 3 wickets in the first couple of overs. In previous seasons I would've dropped aggression after losing the first few wickets so quickly to try to stabilise things but if I'd done that here I doubt I would've scored enough. Instead I kept it at 7 throughout and my last two dedicated batsmen at 5 and 6 came in to strike a great partnership, getting me the win after 18.2 overs. They had a great 25 run over early in their partnership and never looked back from there.

                I'm still not a big fan of 20 Overs, I prefer One Day matches where there's a bit more thought involved. This still feels like smacking it as much as you can and hope for some luck. It's nice enough getting a win like this but I don't really feel like I did anything to achieve it, compared to longer formats where I'm thinking a lot more. The only choice I made was when bowling, holding my spinner a little longer than usual as Durham had a couple of spin preference batsmen in when I'd normally use him.

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                • #68
                  Next match the same pair do this instead in better conditions (and in near max form after the last performance):

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                  It's a funny old game.

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                  • #69
                    This works more often than not for me, but try stagger the aggression levels. I usually have one batsman one bar more aggressive, the other not being slow, but holding an end
                    Nottinghamshire supporter and proud!

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                    • #70
                      A train of thought after posting on another topic but belonging here.

                      Whenever my batting line up in T20s looks fragile or has a habit of collapsing I principally look at three things.

                      First, are they just pants. Especially the openers. Mostly they just aren’t good enough.

                      Secondly, if they are good players with a proven record I look at their form to see if it’s on the way down. If it is I drop them and bring in a form player until my first choice perks up with the 2nds.

                      Thirdly, a more in depth issue, I look to see how they bat - are they a steady Eddie who hits around their average every match or are they all-or-nothing players? This can be an issue with, but is not limited to, very aggressive players in particular. I find if I have a lot of them in the side I mostly get decent scores with a good partnership or two and with the odd massive hit-out or spectacular collapses.

                      If it’s not the first two look at the third and balance the side out or live with the glory-or-bust excitement.

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                      • #71
                        Fairly recent to this (only just moved on to CC20 after being on CC18 for a few years), and one of the reasons I decided to abandon 18 and move on to 20 was I heard the match engine had been improved for T20, but I'm still experiencing the same old problems, especially with batting.

                        I've tried so many of the tips shared on this and for the 18 edition, and still just struggle endlessly with getting results in T20. I've just completed the first batch of T20 Blast games in my first English domestic season, and have been roundly thrashed from pillar to post, even with a number of very handy T20 players in my team. I think reading through this thread, I realise I've still been a bit reluctant to use the most defensive bowling settings, still tending to stick on around 2 or 3 bars of aggression to try to get wickets, so being more defensive in the field is something I'm definitely going to experiment with more.

                        But the batting... jeez. Nothing seems to work! I've just set up a little World XI series to practice a few a games, and even following all the best advice on here (play ball by ball, 2 bars off the top, drop down for the last ball or two of the over especially if I've already hit a couple of boundaries, then up to a higher aggression for the later overs, etc.) but nothing seems consistently successful. The most frustrating thing is still this issue of seeing some of the top players (I'm talking Maxwell, du Plessis, Morgan, Kohli), whatever aggression you put them on, just push and prod, barely keeping a SR of 100, regularly blocking out up to 4 dot balls an over even towards the end when they should be hitting out. If I try attacking from the start I lose too many wickets and am then forced to be a bit careful later on and don't score as quick as I need to. If I start a bit more carefully to keep wickets in hand and then look to hit out later on, I just lose a glut of wickets in the latter part and still don't score that quickly. Either approach means 140-150 is about the most I can ever seem to hope for (and I usually really struggle to make that), which is rarely enough for me to win.

                        A lot of the game seems enjoyably realistic, it's just still this thing about the number of dot balls and slow scoring rates even of top players who are classed as (very) aggressive, no matter what you try with the batting aggression settings. I'm determined to keep trying, but it is really frustrating.
                        Last edited by Jobi1K; 02-21-2021, 07:20 PM.

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                        • #72
                          Wickets fall too often in T20 games compared to real life and also the standard of bowlers batting ability is too low on the game.

                          If you look at today's T20I with Oz V NZ, Oz have Ashton Agar batting at 7 and NZ have Santner. Neither are amazing batters but in a T20, they're good enough to bat at 7. Also teams often only play with 3 or 4 specialist batsmen.

                          You could say today, Australia only played with Finch and Phillipe who were batsmen and then Wade kept wicket, Maxwell, Marsh and Stoinis (who batted top 6) can all bowl, giving Australia 8 bowling options. On the game you've got to go in with a much stronger bowling line up because you often just get skittled.

                          I think that in T20, wickets should fall less regularly and that bowlers should be able to bat more consistently than they do on the game...

                          Sureshot does say to play ball by ball and play each ball differently but that takes a LONG time to do.

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                          • #73
                            Jobi1K
                            to be honest I’m still jumping back on an England save with cc2018 as I feel the match engine this version is more rewarding in the shorter format.
                            In as much as I can do well with both the One day and T20 game, winning the One day comps most seasons. The T20 is so much hit and miss and luck based on 2020 but on 2018 whilst similar, I think I’ve nearly mastered it. Just trying to transfer this now onto 2020 for some better results.
                            When batting use V.agg or Agg batsmen and bat really deep using only 2 specialist bowlers and 3 allrounders as this helps. Yes I’ve had dot balls and blocks last over but I’ve also needed a 6 and got it. (again maybe luck)?
                            Just won the World Cup T20I with England so I’ve got some decent tactics at the moment if you need more advice?

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                            • #74
                              I just spent some time playing CC19, not for the match engine but because there is 100!

                              Having come back to CC20 I have changed my tactics in an attempt to crack batting in T20s. I usually bowl first and once I have some good bowlers usually have low-ish totals to chase down so I started to bat first instead to see if it made a difference.

                              I have always had a suspicion that some of my players become far better if I manage when they play because of how the game engine seems to work from year to year, and while I may be wrong it does seem to hold out.

                              It has always felt that whatever a player averages over the inital season or two that then gets set as a benchmark. If I put in a promising new batsman who is on 80% form and they average 30 in their first T20 season they will have good seasons and bad seasons but will not stray too far from that average. Equally, if the same player is on 20% form and averages 15 they will tend to have better seasons but will not stray too far from that 15 over time, the same goes for strike rate.

                              As such I never put young players in unless they are in really good form but my bowl first policy also seems to help. I am usually chasing 120-135 and so there is little pressure on the batsmen. Especially if I have two strong openers the bowling is more defensive from the start of a new batsman's innings and if I wish I can bring them in on 6 bars for a few balls before moving on up. as such they tend to get good averages - helped by a few not outs. After a few seasons it is set in stone and they are a great player.

                              When I spent a couple of saves (both lasting 6 years) always batting first I found it far harder to bring on batsmen. I think it is because of the dynamic of looking to set the highest total possible rather than chasing down a known target. I would usually expect to have a strong team with say 3 really good T20 regen batsmen by then and a few second choices. In one save I had just one good T20 batsman and 2 in the other.

                              I should say that once the average and strike rate are 'set' for a batsman it makes no difference if I bat first or second and can post or chase 200 with confidence once I have built up the squad.

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                              • #75
                                Thanks Yorkie . To be fair as Yorkshire folk with our team's real life track record we're probably not best place to offer advice about limited overs cricket, but yes I'd certainly be interested to hear any more tactics you have that have worked in this!

                                Since last posting I've had a couple of encouraging results - first, in the final game of the little World XI series I mentioned in my last post I batted first and finally managed to break (only just, mind you!) the magic 200 barrier, and restricted the opposition to around 160 in their reply; then in a domestic game similarly I made it into the late 190s, and using much more defensive bowling tactics than I previously would have, I kept the opposition to barely over 100. I narrowly lost another game that it looked like I was well placed to win until the opposition no.10 top-edged two consecutive 6s in the 19th over, so felt somewhat unlucky. But other games was just more of the same old story, and I finished the T20 campaign bottom of the group with just 3 wins.

                                Not that I want to be the bad workman blaming my tools, but I do think on reflection my current Yorkshire squad is badly lacking in depth to compete in T20. A few of the games clashed with England games so that obviously stripped out all the strongest players, and among the batsmen left available, they are all young and inexperienced and/or also rated average or defensive, and the only attacking ones left (Lyth and Brook) unfortunately both hit a rut of chronically bad form to coincide with the whole T20 competition. With Willey and Rashid on England duty, the remaining all-rounders in the squad are pretty weak comparatively, so I can't really bat all that deep with the available players. Can see the situation in the Challenge Trophy is going to be even worse with basically all my frontline players off playing in the Hundred.

                                So, when recruitment time comes round for next season, I think as well as working on all these great tactical suggestions in this thread, I need to make some major improvements to the squad in terms of limited overs specialists if I want to make any kind of impact in the shorter forms. As cde says, developing a really good squad is clearly vital.
                                Last edited by Jobi1K; 03-02-2021, 01:23 AM.

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